Q&A MISC. Bread Questions
Until we can figure out a more sophisticated way to handle your feedback, your praise and your questions, we hope the following series of Q&A posts will help. Our goal is to get a conversation going about a particular topic in one location. Hoping that it will be easier for you to follow and get the information you need to bake gorgeous bread.
If we haven’t started a thread on the subject you are interested in then leave it here and we can create another post!
Thank you so much for all of the conversation. We enjoy it immensely and are learning so much from you all!
Zoë and Jeff
Well, I did it to both of them and they are out sitting on the counter again. I’ll keep them out until I get too tired and then put them both back in the fridge. I’ll send reports later on both of them.
Pat
So I am a poor college student who loves to make bread. Of the things you have in your book as needed- what do I really need and need to spluge on. I know it is all worth it but I only have so much to spend. I am betting the stone is one thing but do I really need a pizza peel, can I just use the parchment paper method? Also is it logical to make the dough and then split it into two differnt bowls so I din’t have to buy an new bigger one?
Your bread is just fantastic!! I discovered the recipe through a cooking forum here in Spain, and I have ordered the book and can’t wait to receive it!
I would like to know if you intend to translate your book into some other languages (Spanish included, of course).
COngratulations for your success!!
Heather: if you have parchment, you can get away without the peel. The stone is nice for getting great crust, but you can bake on a cookie sheet instead. It’s fine to split the dough into two bowls covered with plastic wrap.
In fact nothing is truly essential– though the thermometer will be nice if your oven is off by more than 25 degrees (many are).
Maria: Gracias por todo! Publisher isn’t likely to approve a translation but we’re still trying to get them to change their mind. Jeff
if I use a cookie sheet do I need to do steam?
I’d use it, yes. Same issues if you do without, a thicker, harder crust that’s difficult to brown. But no matter what, your crust won’t be as good on a cookie sheet. Pop it off for the last third of baking, that seems to help.
Hi Jeff, thanks for the answer. I can’t really bake it longer since the crust was really brown and started to become black. So I took it out of the oven after 30 min.
The 1st boule I bake was the same day that I had prepare the mix and it turned out to be perfect inside. I wonder why after 6 days it is chewy.
Next batch I’ll add some flour to my mix and see if I get a less chewy middle.
Helene: Sounds like your oven may be too hot (crust burns, inside’s raw). Check your oven temp with an inexpensive oven thermometer (https://www.amazon.com/Taylor-Gourmet-Thermometer-Stainless-Steel%252fCopper/dp/B000HB5NA4?&camp=212361&linkCode=wey&tag=arbrinfimiada-20&creative=380725)
I used to make sourdough pancakes back in the days when I kept a sourdough starter. Has anyone ever tried using any of the stored doughs like this? Jeff and Zoe, any thoughts about this?
Hi Jeff and Zoe, I love the book. I have made the master recipe and the European Peasant bread, both to great success. I have two questions: 1) When it comes to steam, should I be seeing giant puffs as the bread bakes. I see steam when I first put the water in the broiler pan, but not much after. I would like my bread a little crispier. 2) I cannot locate the malted wheat flakes for the English Granary bread. King Arthur doesn’t carry it anymore. I loved this bread when I lived in the UK and would love to re-create it at home. Any other sources would be great. Thanks for revolutionizing my bread baking.
I have just received and begun to read your book. I live in Colorado at about 7200 ft. elevation, a location which makes much baking tricky. I found nothing in your book that addresses high-altitude factors and would appreciate some suggestions. Maybe it’s covered somewhere in the questions and comments on your website but it would take me a week to read through them!
Kathleen: Haven’t tried it, let us know if you have any luck with it. My guess is that older batches will do the trick, in addition to the usual leavening in sourdough pancakes (they don’t usually rely on the sourdough alone, do they).
Doug: Don’t expect large puffs of steam, it tends to be modest. Just close the door as fast as you can (w/o slamming it!). The only place I’ve heard that you can now get granary flour in the US is in health food stores, but I haven’t found it myself. You can order from the UK, just google it (haven’t done it myself since KAF stopped carrying).
Heather: Check out our “Search” field, scrolling down on the left side and type in what you’re looking for. We need to fix that so it’s higher on the page, sorry about that. What you need is at https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=144
Oh, WOW, that Deli Rye is fabulous! A real “10!” We had it tonight with deli mustard, salami, and baked onion rings. Fabulous.
Actually, I wasn’t sure it would bake up ok. I set the loaf to rise and got too busy running errands. The loaf got a weird crusty topping on it while sitting out. But I promised my husband deli rye, and we were really excited about it (you can’t get this in NE TN). When i slashed it with the serrated knife, it deflated. It baked up fine, but it wasn’t a high riser. Had I baked it sooner, would it have risen more?
We ended up eating the whole loaf, it was so good! And it was much easier making salami sandwiches by slicing it sideways!
THANKS!~
oh, Jeff, I left some questions on challah on the challah page. Don’t know if you get to that page as often. would love your feedback. Thanks.
Judy
PS–I am counting all my Weight Watcher points, trying not to gain weight on this wonderful bread!!!
Judy: If you rest/rise the loaves for longer than 40 minutes, consider using a plastic wrap loosely over it, or create some other humid environment. Then you won’t get that shell. May have over-proofed a bit, giveing you less rise but sounds like a winner anyway.
Hi Jeff,
Baked my first 100% whole wheat bread and it was great (even tho I messed up a bit when mixing; won’t go into that). Since I don’t have a pizza stone yet and can’t find my bread pan, I baked it in my cast iron skillet (greased) and it came out great. I am investing in the equipment and wondered if you had a preference on pizza stones. Unfortunately, many of the reviews don’t tell you how thick they are so I am having trouble deciding. (I have an Amazon gift certificate and think this would be a great way to use it). Regards, Suzan
Hi, I LOVE the idea of the table for breads you can make from one dough. Until it’s in the book, can you put a table like this on this website?
Also, I would love to buy a spiral bound edition of the cookbook. I usually buy the paperback edition, then take it to laminate the cover and have it spiral bound. It stays open really nicely. I prop it up, and put a piece of plastic wrap over it to reduce splattering.
A friend of mine has made a similar challah dough for years. She covers it with wax paper and then a towel. Not airtight, and easier to work with than plastic wrap. I would think it’s better on the environment also.
Happy Baking! Judy
Suzan: The half-inch thick Old Stone Oven brand on our website’s homepage (left-hand column) has been well-received (no one’s told me that it cracked). The similar 14×16 inch stone at Williams-Sonoma carries a lifetime guarantee against cracking.
Judy: We don’t quite know yet the exact final form of the new book so not sure we’ll have room to include the table.
Thanks, Jeff!
REALLY, THANKS! I baked up 2 more loaves of the deli rye (they look great.
But I also decided that today is the day I finally try my mother’s recipe for apple strudel, taught to her by an elderly neighbor.
I tried putting her on audio tape about 20+ years ago and standing next to her with a measuring cup as she threw ingredients into a bowl. I typed the “recipe” and comments out about 10 years ago, but I wasn’t baking much then. My mother is across the country, and doesn’t bake anymore.
My baking experience has improved within the last year. As I baked, memories came back to me. But also 2 helpful tips from you–
1. Cover the dough so it doesn’t dry out. I worked kinda slow, as I am new to this.
2. Use a serrated knife. As I cut the pieces from the roll, the filling began to fall out. I remembered your comments, and asked my husband to quickly get me the long serrated knife from the drawer. He did, and the dough cut much better! I then remembered that my mom’s knife WAS a long serrated knife.
Your tips must have been the last pieces of my puzzle in trying to make this special recipe. THANKS.
Judy
Judy: about covering. It’s OK to skip it, as in our book, for short rest times (eg., 40 minutes). But in winter, in very dry environments, some readers prefer to cover it when they do a longer rest. Rising may be slightly better.
It is pretty dry right now. I wasn’t taking any chances with the dough drying out, especially when a friend called to talk to me. So I covered it.
Wish you could enjoy some of this struedel with us.
Judy
Also, I decided to try the deli rye without using parchment paper. I put a bunch of cornmeal on my work surface and slid the loaf on it to get cornmeal to stick to the bottom (I saw that on a challah video). Then I put a lot more cornmeal on my pizza peel.
Even so, the bread stuck to the pizza peel after rising. I found that using the serrated knife, I was able to nudge it free and onto the baking stone.
Did I do anything wrong?
Nah, it happens this way. Sometimes it needs “encouragement” and what you did is pretty much exactly what I do, though I tend to use the long-handled pancake flipper.
This book is the most useful cookbook I have ever had. I am an experienced home cook and baker and I have hundreds of cookbooks, from Betty Crocker to Julia Child and everything in between. I’ve only had it for a week, and I’ve already made the limpa, the boule, and the Portugese corn bread, and they are all fabulous. I can’t wait to try some of the other doughs. Here’s my question: my husband is a committed store-bought-bread eater. He likes the soft, squishy kind with a mile-long list of chemical ingredients. Now that I can make bread so quickly and easily, I’d like to ban that stuff from the house, but I’ll have to replace it with something he’ll eat. Which of your breads would you recommend for such a misguided bread eater?
Hi Kathleen,
Thank you so much, it is incredibly high praise to be named in the line up of books that you have and use!
You may want to try baking the challah or Brioche in a loaf pan. Or the buttermilk dough is nice and tender as well. If you bake him the loaf pan breads just keep in mind that our recipe calls for a rather small loaf. I would fill the pan about 3/4 full (instead of 1/2) and allow them to rest for 30-40 minutes more before baking. You will also need to add 10-15 minutes to the baking times.
I think with some of these loaves he will be happy with the soft texture.
Happy Baking! Zoë
I was looking at the 100% whole wheat sandwich bread and was confused about the 2 different ways to bake it. In the book, it says to put it in the loaf pan at 350 degrees but that we can also mold it into a ball like the boule. But, do I treat it like the boule and raise the temp to 450 and have it in for less time or keep it at 35 for 5-60 minutes?
Jake: Keep the temp at 350 for this loaf, it has honey which could burn at the higher temp. You may need less time in the boule form, but not that much. Check at about 2/3s of the way through.
I’m sure someone has already asked these questions but I couldn’t make it through all 900 posts LOL. I LOVE your bread but being “baking challenged” I’m having some problems. The first time I made it the dough seemed too dry, the second time it seemed too wet, then the thrid time I made it it was perfect the first 2 days. But on the third day it seemed to seriously deflate and then formed a layer of water on top. I tried to use up the dough today (day 7 I think) and it was bad 🙁 It smelt funny and wouldn’t hold a shape at all its sort of spread when I dumped it out on to a floured surface. What happened?
I made a new batch when I realized the old one wasn’t going to work. I put it in an air tight tupperware with the lid cracked and after a few hours in the fridge went to shape my dough and it had formed a dry crusty layer on top. Is that normal? What can I do to prevent it because even after baked there were hard parts in the bread. Thanks so much, I can’t wait for the second book!
I found your recipe in Mother Earth News. Not only was I impressed by the simpicity and convenience, I was floored by your willingness to share all of your “secrets” for free! I was so impressed I decided to fork over the $$ for your book!
To try to make a long story short, I gave your technique a try, and I am hooked. The book came from Amazon the very day I was ready to bake. My first loaf was small, but that’s perfect for me. I used a silpat with a little cornmeal, let it rise the 40 minutes, then started preheating for 20 with the broiler pan. The loaf didn’t seem to rise much, as you said. Floured, slashed, Boiled some water, poured it in, and put the silpat-covered cookie sheet in. In 30 minutes it puffed up like one of those toy footballs you see in the Dollar Store! Took it out and put it on the cooking rack, and yes, it did crackle and “sing”! It looked just like the picture on your dustcover.
I had made a half batch as I am always suspect of new things, so next day went to Walmart and bought a $10 stone, a tall rubbermaid container, and a thin nylon cutting board for $2 that now serves as my “peel”. Baked the rest of the batch, got the same great results, and made a full batch. Only problem is, I opened a new bag of flour and used that before I noticed that it was bleached white flour. I tossed in a few tablespoons of gluten, but I haven’t baked any bread yet, so wish me luck.
I have discovered what the heck a “custard” crumb is, and I like it! My old wall oven is small and probably not very tight, so could be the reason my crust was not thin and crisp, but I like it chewy anyway. I might give it a go in a dutch oven to see if there is a difference.
What is the big deal with kosher salt and sea salt? I haven’t got that educated a palate, and I have yet to have any of my friends and family tell me that the salt in my bread tastes any different. I can’t wait to get home tonight to pop in another loaf! This method truly is made for busy people!
Hi Tanya,
The dough as it ages will deflate in the bucket and will never rise again as it stores. In fact it won’t rise until it has been put in the oven after resting. It may spread out as it rests and then it should have some oven “spring” when it goes in the oven.
The dough will sometimes develop an alcohol smell to it and this is totally normal and natural. It is a by product of the yeast and is actually a natural preservative for your dough, nothing to be afraid of at all. You can just pour this liquid off the top and proceed.
If you find the breads that your dough bakes up are too flat towards the end of the 2 weeks you can always just add the last of the batch to a new batch. Just dump the new ingredients right on top of the “old” dough and mix it all together. This will jump start the flavor of your fresh batch.
As for the dry layer of dough on your last batch, it is caused by too much air circulating in the bucket. Just pop the seal to your bucket, but you should not actually have a big enough opening to even see into the bucket.
I hope this helps! Happy Baking!
Zoë
Hi Sue,
So glad you are giving the book a try!
The crust on your bread will be much thinner and crisper when you bake it on your new stone!
The only difference in the salt is the size of the flakes. You are right, once the salt is baked into the recipe you really can’t taste a difference. But, it measures very differently. If you are using table salt you may find our recipes a bit salty. If so, just decrease the amount of salt slightly and you will find the amount that suits your palate.
Have fun! Zoë
Zoe thanks so much!! I wish I had asked the question before I’d thrown the dough out. We eat fresh bread almost every days in some variety now. I’m going to be as big as a house soon 😀
I wanted to say thank you for making this so easy. I made my first loaf pan bread today. I’ve done 3 boules as well with success. I had trouble with my second boule sticking to my cookie sheet, but when I coat the cookie sheet with oil and flour it remedies that. I’ve been letting it rest on the cookie sheet since I don’t have a peel or a stone. I plan to buy a stone soon anyway. I used a metal loaf pan even though you suggest non-stick. I oiled and floured it and it turned out good, but only lightly crusty where the pan touches. I’m still quite happy with it. The top crust was glorious!
Mary: If you can coax the loaf out of the pan 2/3’s of the way through baking, the sides and bottom of the loaf will crisp up nicely. Just finish it right on an oven shelf.
I’m on my third batch of the master-recipe dough and am having great fun, baking a loaf a day, at least. I misremembered the instructions and have been letting the dough rest for only 20 minutes instead of the suggested 40 minutes to 1 1/2 hours. It’s been coming out fine; maybe it will be even better when I follow directions! I would like for my next batch to be 100% whole wheat, but I’d like to do it free-form and without the milk, honey and oil your recipe (page 76) calls for. Will it work? Thanks!
Is it normal for the bread dough to lose some of it’t rise while it’s in the fridge? When I put it in it was up to the top of the container, it’s been sitting in there several days and I notices that it has sank several inches.
Diego: It will work, but it will be drier. It will help to boost the protein with vital wheat gluten (which attracts water molecules in the dough structure). See https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=142 for how to use it. Longer rises definitely are helpful with WW.
Pam: Yes, definitely normal. Our method depends on “oven spring,” the sudden burst of expansion when the loaf hits the hot stone. Should be OK. Jeff
Jeff and Zoe,
May I make a free-form loaf out of your sunflower seed bread recipe?
Everything I’ve tried has come out perfect! I thank you, and so does my whole family!
-Beth
Thanks for the suggestions from this website! I bought a Taylor oven thermometer today. The temperature is so much larger and easier to read than my old Ekco one!
And I also found that set of 3 Rubbermaid 6 qt round storage containers at Sam’s Club. Wow, what a deal for under $15!! I can use them as dough buckets, or store flour in them in the fridge. I have been having the dough rise in my pyrex bowls, but this container is taller–rather than wide. Easier to put on the top shelf of my garage fridge. That’s important, because my car is close by, and I can’t open the fridge door much. I went with a bunch of gals who like to cook, and one gal (a caterer) said these are the type of buckets used for pizza dough.
I’m still looking for a pizza peel that I like. They are either too thin or too thick and heavy wood.
But I just wanted to say that I not only appreciate Jeff and Zoe’s comments–I also appreciate those of the other posters. THANKS, Judy
oh, I picked up 5 lbs of Gold Medal flour to try the recipe. I am a real fan of King Arthur flour and have needed to guess the proper consistency. I think I’ll get to know the right consistency with lower protein flour first. I found that when I added extra water to the batch of deli rye, it seemed too wet for me. But it baked up GREAT!!! So I want to get used to the right consistency.
Strange thing, though. Compare the size of the package of 5 lb. of Gold Medal to 5 lb. of King Arthur. The Gold Medal seems like a tiny package!
I hope you come out with a paperback edition of your first book. Because I’d like to make it into a spiral bound book that will lay flat in my cookbook holder.
Any possibility?
Hi Beth,
You certainly can make it into a free-form loaf. Just shape as you would any of the free-form recipes, let it rise between 45-90 minutes, depending on how large a loaf you are making and if the dough has been chilled first. Bake it at 375 for about 35 minutes.
Enjoy! Zoë
Jeff & Zoe
I was given your book for Christmas and my daughter (12 and has NO fear of baking anything!) and I are having a ball! I’ve been baking bread for about 15 years and have done everything from using a bread machine (gave that up several years ago) to grinding my own grain and your method is wonderful! Prior to learing this technique I didn’t have the time to bake everyday. I must say I was a bit skeptical about not kneading etc but we have been very pleased so far. This is my question, the bread (master recipe) seems to have a very yeasty, almost “drunk on wine” flavor. It is not a mellow sourdough flavor but too yeasty. Any suggestions? Thanks so much!
I just have a quick question about storing the dough. You suggested getting a tupperware like container. Would it also work to put it in a metal bowl w/ saran wrap over the top? Just wanted to save me a little money upfront until a decide if I like the bread. Thanks, Natalie
Clarisa: Experienced bakers sometimes prefer less yeast… ours is on the higher end of the yeast spectrum, because we knew that some readers, especially skeptical beginners, would want a quick result on Day 1, and maybe even bake that day. But you can decrease the yeast and get a mellower flavor, go to https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=85
Natalie: Metal with saran wrap is fine.
Hi Jeff and Zoe:
I’ve searched the posts for ideas on hamburger buns. I have something called ‘muffin top pans’. Do you think I could bake the dough in these? They are non-stick. Also, I would like to have as much whole wheat flour in them as possible. What dough and substitutions should I make?
BTW, I made a pizza dough out of the 100% whole wheat bread dough and it was great. My pizza stone is on order so I rolled it on a silicon mat, preheated the cookie sheet, and moved the mat and dough to the sheet. Most frozen pizzas made with wwheat flour are soggy and ho hum. This came out nice and crisp and tasted great. (Pizza stone arrived yesterday so I’ll be trying it on that in a short while). Love the book; love the website.
Suzan
Sounds like that pan will work, or else make flattened rounds and do them on a stone, cookie sheet, silicone mat, or parchment. If you start swapping in WW, you need more water; keep the consistency about the same as in our Master Recipe (page 26).
You can do WW buns, even up to 100% as on page 76. Check out https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=142 also, might be nice to add VWG if you’re interested in lots of whole grain.
Using your olive oil bread recipe I created a thin crust pizza. Yummie! Using a smaller size ball of dough I rolled it out in between parchment paper and oiled saran wrap. I squared it to the size of the stone. Made it super thin. Pulled off saran and topped pizza. Put the pizza peel under saran and pizza and throw it on top of stone. While cooking I left the oven door cracked so it would not heat on top. Perfectly crunchy thin pizza!
Hi Steven: Super-thin is great; I’m often too lazy to get it that thin, but sounds like you have a great way to do it. Love hearing how people adapt our multi-purpose doughs the their taste and preference.
Hi.Great book, thanks!
I ran a search both on your site and on the Web for a bread based on your recipes, but with bananas. Before I attempt to do something on my own… which I’m perfectly willing to do, being a long time baker, chef and experimenter…. I was wondering if anyone anywhere had already come up with something. I’d like to have a starting point for my experiments. A mashed banana recipe would be best, but anything with them would do.
Thanks in advance to you and all your readers/followers.
Ceinan