Q&A MISC. Bread Questions
Until we can figure out a more sophisticated way to handle your feedback, your praise and your questions, we hope the following series of Q&A posts will help. Our goal is to get a conversation going about a particular topic in one location. Hoping that it will be easier for you to follow and get the information you need to bake gorgeous bread.
If we haven’t started a thread on the subject you are interested in then leave it here and we can create another post!
Thank you so much for all of the conversation. We enjoy it immensely and are learning so much from you all!
Zoë and Jeff
Hi LJ,
Is it possible your dough is too dry? It sounds like you don’t have enough moisture to get any stretch?
Zoë
Zoe–thanks for stopping in here. It doesn’t seem as if the dough is too dry. I checked my volume/weight measure of the flour just to make sure I had the ratios right and added extra water to account for the higher protein flour (KA all purpose). And the look of the dough matches the photos you posted on the blog.
I made a loaf today from start to finish, without refrigerating the dough and it seemed to cloak more easily. I also didn’t pull the cloak all the way to the bottom of the ball and that seemed to be better.
I’m wondering if my fridge is too cold and that’s affecting the way the dough cloaks. Is that something you’ve come across?
I am an experienced bread maker and I find your recipes fine. The breads are tasty. I am used to using weight for measuring flour and the rest of the ingredients. Can you tell me the weight of 1 cup of flour. I know its somewhere on your website but Ican’t find it. Thanks
Marty
Hi Jeff and Zoe,
I’m loving (obsessed) with your book!! My question: if I want to bake more than one loaf of bread during the day, how do I adjust the oven temperature for the second loaf? I.e., the first loaf goes in when the oven is not yet at 450 degrees, but the oven is up to that temp by the end of 30 minutes. Do I have to start all over? Thanks so much!!
Hi Marty,
Thank you for trying the recipes! We are thrilled that so many experienced bakers are willing to add it to their repertoire.
Here is the weight info:
https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=140
Thanks, Zoë
Hi Ellen,
The next loaf can go straight in after the first. The nice hot oven will be wonderful for the bread. We just didn’t want people to feel like they had to wait all day to preheat their ovens to the full 450 degrees.
Thanks! Zoë
Hi Jeff and Zoe, here’s a question about pre-measuring and storing dough mixes: I really want to turn on everybody I know to your book, but many I know are resistant to taking that first step to just try it out. My idea is to mix up the dry ingredients for several of your dough recipes, and give zip-lock bags of dry mix with “just add 3 cups of water” written on the outside, or whatever is appropriate to the specific recipe, and give that with the book. Here’s my concern — how long will yeast least, out of it’s foil packet (actually I’m using bulk yeast that is stored in a plastic tupperware), and will it be affected by contact for extended periods of time with the other dry ingredients? Please tell me there’s no reason this can’t work (or I could always write an “expiration date” on the bags). I just think the bread-mix idea, coupled with a couple of plastic tubs, a pizza stone, and a really nice wooden spoon would be the ultimate house-warming gift. What does your experience say?
-Celene
Celene: Short answer– there’s no reason this shouldn’t work! Go for it. I bet that the yeast lasts for months and months outside it’s airtight container (remember that I buy in bulk so it’s not airtight in the first place). I love your idea.
Jeff
LJ: I wonder if you’re taking us too literally, pulling the dough all the way to the bottom? Try with a less aggressive movement. And then, try it with lower-protein flour, like Gold Medal unbleached AP, or even Pillsbury unbleached AP (which is about the lowest protein I’ve come across).
Jeff
Well, I am used to ‘beating up’ on dough with years of traditional bread making and kneading. LOL. Will try with a lighter hand.
🙂
Thanks.
Thanks, Jeff. I’m happy the bread mix idea will work. Now, another question about forming really small brioche single-servings. What I have in mind is to use square baking forms (smaller than the standard muffin tin) and fill them with individual balls of brioche dough.I think I’ll be using apricot-to-peach size dough balls, which are too small for me to “pull around to the bottom” the way I can with a grapefruit sized piece. Can I simply roll the dough ball in a little bit of flour and continue rolling it against the counter until it’s absorbed some of the flour, or is the “pulling the dough round to the bottom” elemental in the crust formation?
Celene: I’ll take a crack at this but Zoe may have more to add…
“Cloaking” isn’t absolutely required, especially when you have a pan that will contain lateral spreading. Just roll it around as you suggest but don’t overdo it with the flour and don’t let it incorporate. Likewise don’t over-squash it when you roll it, the less handling the better. Jeff
Okie dokie. I shall proceed unafraid of ruining the precious brioche dough. 🙂
Hi Celene,
This dough is very forgiving and can withstand some serious abuse, like kneading and rolling and shaping without any harm. You have to let it rise for a rather long time and it always comes out beautifully!
Don’t be afraid. All you want to do is create a smooth top to your dough so that your brioche has a nice crust but it is not essential to achieve this by fully cloaking the dough. The way you describe in your note will work well!
Have fun. Zoë
I, too love this book. I have become a bread baking fiend! RE: plastic storage buckets. A 5 qt ice cream bucket with lid(I used Kemps) seems to work well for one batch of 4 loaves. the dough seems to rise as much as it wants to, and the bucket fits well in the fridge. You have a very wonderful and helpful site here. Nancy
Thanks Nancy, other ice-cream re-users have seconded your suggestion. Jeff
I just wanted to say how much I love your book!
My boyfriend of five years is a crazy bread fiend and has been asking that I get a bread maker for months.
Now I don’t need one.
I’m going to surprise him this weekend with doughy deliciousness. Who knows? Your great book might just result in a wedding.
Kelly: If he proposes through this website, we want to be at your wedding. We’ll bring the bread. Jeff
Ok, I made the Babka, which is wonderful, however I have a question.
My bundt pan took 3 one pound rounds to fill. Are the chocolate and raisins listed in the ingredients, for a one pound bread, or should I have increased it for each round?
After cutting the bread, it seems like it could have used more chocolate.
Hi Susan,
I’m so glad you made the Babka, I love that recipe. Next time you will want to increase the filling to match the amount of dough it takes to fill your pan. You will also need to increase the rising time.
Thanks, Zoë
Even my baker sister is impressed by this stuff! One question: since I am one of those with pizza-peel-removal difficulties, I tried using parchment paper, but the bread ended up sticking to the paper and ended up with a soft, rather ragged bottom crust. Was my dough too wet?
Thank You for writing such a good book. I have really enjoyed baking bread again. My ? is, I put my dough in the frig. w/o letting it rise first. Can I just take it out even tho it was in the frig over night, let it rise and then bake it?? Thank you
I’m having such a wonderful time with the book! My 10 year old daughter and I have been trying to perfect our pain d’epi technique with pretty good success (and dad and little brother are happy to eat the experiments)! But I tried the brioche with chocolate ganache and it was kind of a mess — the loaf split open on the sides during baking and a fair amount of the chocolate oozed out everywhere. It still tasted great, but looked (and made) kind of a mess. I’m wondering what might have happened. I did use challah dough instead of brioche, but I can’t imagine that would be the problem. The other thing I changed was that I made a longer, thinner loaf and baked it directly on the stone instead of a loaf pan. Would that be the problem? The only other thing I can think of is that I should have slashed the top once or twice, although that’s not suggested in the recipe.
Thanks for a wonderful book!
Lisa
I just wanted to respond to Pat McCollem’s question; I did the math for weight watcher’s and, if you cut a 1# loaf into 12 equal slices it’s 1 Point per slice, 2 points for 2 slices, etc.
Grace and Peace,
` tim
Thanks for this wonderful approach to bread baking. You have given us a true gift!
Your recipe for Whole Wheat Sandwich Bread says that it makes good freeform loaves cooked with a baking stone. In this case, do you go back to the same 450 temp. and shorter time like the master and partial wheat recipes? Or does the wheat flour need a slower/longer cooking time?
Thanks.
Ann
Two questions – on the cloaking, the problem I find is I wind up with a “crater” on the bottom which leads (I think) to cracking on the bottom of the boule. For a beginner, what’s the best technique to get a smooth bottom crust on the boule, etc?
Second question is that I’ve made the brioche dough and from that the pecan caramel rolls to rave reviews. But the brioche dough doesn’t rise as much as the master or whole wheat. Is that normal? If not, what should I try to get more rise?
Henry
I love your cookbook and can hardly wait every day to try a new recipe! Can you tell me how to use your doughs for pizza crust? I loved to make homemade pizza in the past and I would think this method would be an easy way to start up again.
Hi Jeff and Zoe, thought you would enjoy hearing about my last minute bread party. Two friends showed up with 5 quart containers. (They were supposed to have watched the movie on the website first…hmmm.) I had them take some of my dough from the batches I had going and shape (ok, mangle) them, rise them and bake them. While we waited, they each made up a batch of the plain boule dough to take home in their buckets. The bread was wonderful of course, some looking more, er, rustic than others but all tasting delicious. Also, I have been doing King Arthur White whole wheat up to 3 cups in the basic boule and it come s out great–funny taupe color but good crumb and crust. Let’s do a big party in NYC!
Hi Marta,
It could be that the dough was wet and ended up soaking the parchment. Try dusting just a little bit of flour under the next loaf.
So happy to hear you are enjoying the book. Has your sister baked with it yet?
Thanks, Zoë
Hi Shari,
What a great party! Thanks for sharing this with your friends. I’m glad you all enjoyed the bread.
Sounds like fun, if we come to NYC we’ll have to join you! Zoë
Hi Bobby,
If your dough had a chance to rise overnight in the fridge it is probably just fine. Take it out and treat it as normal.
Did it rise quite a bit in the refrigerator?
Zoë
Hi Lisa,
If you bake the chocolate ganache bread as a free-form loaf (not in a loaf pan) then I would recommend not rolling it out as thinly. You will want more dough around the filling to hold it in. If you slash the top of the loaf first it will break open more evenly.
I would also bake it on a cookie sheet lined with parchment and not directly on the stone.
Enjoy! Zoë
Hi Henry,
If your boule is leaving a crater on the bottom and it isn’t blending back together as it rises I think your dough may be too dry. What kind of flour are you using? Check out our Q&A about flours. https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=140
The brioche dough should be rising as high as the other doughs. It just takes a lot longer for this dough to rest. Depending on the size of the loaf it can rest for 1 1/2-2 hours before baking. Is it possible that it didn’t sit long enough before it was baked?
Please let me know if any of this helps!
Thanks, Zoë
Hi Ann,
You should leave the temperature of the oven lower when baking the whole wheat sandwich loaves in a loaf pan or free-form. It is the addition of milk, butter and honey that requires the lower temperature.
Enjoy! Zoë
Do you recommend using a particular dough for pizza crust, and if so how do you bake it?
Hi Lady Di,
If you are using the recipe from the book then you will find pizza recipes on pages 135-145.
If you are getting the recipe from a newspaper than this is my advice. Roll the dough out as thin as possible, put on your toppings and then bake it on a pizza stone that is preheated to 550 degrees. Make sure you have lots of cornmeal on the peel so the dough doesn’t stick as you are getting it into the oven.
Enjoy! Zoë
Hi there —
I just picked up the book a few days ago. One of the problems with so many cookbooks is that there is an assumption you’re cooking for a family or at least a couple. I’m a single girl and I’d like to bake smaller boules & loaves — maybe 1/2 pound rather than a pound, or maybe even rolls rather than loaves. I’m assuming that the baking temp would be the same, but the time in the oven would be less. Any guidelines to offer?
Hi FG,
I have to say it is one of the best things about this method that you can bake a single roll if you want. I would use the same temp and keep an eye on the oven after about 20 minutes if you are baking something really small. Again we always recommend going by the color. If it is deeply brown then it should be done.
Enjoy! Thanks, Zoë
Marta: In another thread on this site it was suggested that you slide the parchment paper AND loaf from the pizza peel onto the stone; halfway through baking slide the parchment paper out from under the bread and the bottom should then nicely brown. This should work even if your dough was a tad too wet.
I have become positively evangelical about your book. I just tramp around waving it and urging people to BUY IT NOW. We’ve done the boule, the buttermilk, and a flatbread ~ all successful beyond my wildest dreams.
Now easter’s coming, i’d really like to make a ‘sort of’ hot cross bun ~ well a fruit bun basically. Can you provide any help in this area re recipe. I was thinking the brioche dough perhaps with lots of fruit and an egg wash. Does that sound right.
Looking forward to many more recipes.
Hi Kerrie,
I think your book waving is working the word seems to be getting out! Thanks so much for your enthusiasm.
Did you take a look at the Panettone recipe on page 201? If you just add nutmeg and remove the lemon extract and zest you are pretty much there.
You could even add the icing:
1 1/2 cups confectioners sugar
1/4 teaspoon vanilla
2 tablespoons warm milk
Just mix it all together and slather it on!
Thanks again and enjoy the bread!
Zoë
Hi Zoe,
I recently spotted one of your sweet dough recipes on a blog – https://stickygooeycreamychewy.blogspot.com/2008/02/who-needs-no-knead-doughnuts.html.
The recipe ofcourse is from your book ‘Artisan bread in five minutes’. This is a master recipe for brioche/challah.
The dough that I came up with is very sticky and soft inspite of refrigeration. I am thinking this is because I spooned flour into cups when measuring ending up with less flour.
I have posted some pics and more detail about a test loaf I baked, here: https://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/6248/artisan-bread-five-minutes-briochechallah#comment-32034
Please let me know if the crust and crumb look right. Also can I add more flour to the dough at this point? Do you have measurements by weight for the flour in this recipe.
I appreciate any feeback.
Thanks.
BNB
Hi BNB,
I think you are right, all of our recipes call for a scoop and sweep method of measuring. This will give you much more flour than spooning it in. Here is the weights that we use for the flour:
https://artisanbreadinfive.com/?p=140
I think your crust and crumb look good but I will be curious to see how it comes out with more flour added. You can add more flour at this point by putting the dough in a mixer and adding it a little at a time.
Good luck and thanks! Zoë
Hi Zoe,
I have made 2 loaves of the light wheat peasant bread from your book and they are excellent–however, on both occasions the loaves had a tendency to form a ball in the oven rather than being flat on the bottom! Is there a reason for this? It wasn’t really a problem as it made a nice sandwich slice, but it was probably not supposed to look like that….and I would feel bad if they rolled off the stone sometime while baking…! 😉
Wow Lady Di,
Are they really that round??? your dough may be a bit dry if they are standing up so high? Does the crumb on the inside feel too tight as well?
This is a mystery. If you have any pictures let me know!
thanks, Zoë
I am having a blast baking bread for all of my friends at the gym. I would like to know if I can substute beer and some white vinegar for some of the water in your recipe. I think that this would give the bread a stronger sour dough flavor.
Hi again,
The first ’round’ loaf really did look like a basketball in the oven. I took a pic of this 2nd one which still came up off the pan a fair amount but has flattened as it has cooled, and a small ridge on the very bottom looks like compressed dough. I’d love for your to see the photo to judge the crumb–How would I do that?
I believe my dough is just over a week old now and I went to bake it and there was a lot of liquid in the bottom of my bucket and the dough was very, very sticky and had a strong odour to it. The smell wasn’t bad, just more like alcohol then it’s usual dough smell. Is this normal or is my dough past it’s prime?
Hi…I love your book/technique. I received an autographed copy for Christmas (from a Common Good Books book signing).
I had great success until this week…without thinking I made up the master recipe with…bleached enriched flour. Ick. The dough is way too wet and hard to deal with. The taste was still decent tasting enough to bake the rest of the loaves, but its really hard to deal with…is there anything to do at this point to improve handling or results? Or do I just need to restart with my King Arthur’s unbleached?
Thanks!!
I’m going to try to answer a bunch of questions in one post, so here goes:
Jessie: beer and white vinegar work. Substitute 1/2 cup beer and 2 tablespoons white vinegar for an equal amount of water in our regular recipe. Let us know how it works for you.
Lady Di: Can you post the photo to a website of your own?
Kelly: At one week old, I doubt that the dough is past its prime. Use more flour to dust and shape, and if you find it’s hard to prevent sideways spreading, use a loaf pan. What you’re describing is normal and most people will very much enjoy the sourdough characteristics you are devloping in this batch.
Amy: Great to have seen you at Common Good Books. Bleached flour has lower protein than unbleached and protein absorbs water, so if you do make that substitution, you have to either increase the flour or decrease the water. It’s not to late to try to incorporate some flour (1/4-cup), mix it in, and let it sit at room temperature for two hours before putting it back into the fridge. Let us know how you do. Jeff